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abolish misery

Posted 06 March 2011 - 04:50 PM

View PostPunk Rock Geek, on 22 February 2011 - 12:27 PM, said:

I know what the idea is.  I'm talking about the reality.  In all likelihood, the revolution isn't going to go exactly as planned, and the more people you involve in it, the greater the chance of something, somewhere going wrong.  I'm not saying that we should actively try to prevent worldwide (anarchist) revolution.  I'm saying that we shouldn't be waiting for it, because even if it did happen, it wouldn't be desirable in comparison to small scale (anarchist) revolutions.
I completely disagree. The only way a revolution can be successful in destroying capital is if it is worldwid...

abolish misery

Posted 06 March 2011 - 04:33 PM

View PostPunk Rock Geek, on 25 February 2011 - 04:28 PM, said:

Good timing:


Hundreds of North Koreans have clashed with security forces in the town of Sinuiju on the border with China. The incident occurred on February 18 last, but the news was only leaked yesterday. The crackdown by the military regime of Kim Jong-il caused injuries and, perhaps, four or five dead, even if there is no confirmation. The riots are caused by progressive deterioration of economic conditions, as confirmed yesterday, by an AsiaNews source. However, the strict control exercised by the dictatorship and lack of 'free' media like the Internet, eliminate...


Punk Rock Geek

Posted 25 February 2011 - 04:28 PM

View PostPunk Rock Geek, on 22 February 2011 - 12:27 PM, said:

Free speech is one of the greatest lines of defense against government brainwashing.  So in North Korea's case, smaller reforms are necessary before large change is possible.

Good timing:


Hundreds of North Koreans have clashed with security forces in the town of Sinuiju on the border with China. The incident occurred on February 18 last, but the news was only leaked yesterday. The crackdown by the military regime of Kim Jong-il caused injuries and, perhaps, four or five dead, even if there is no confirmation. The riots are caused by progressive deteriorat...


Punk Rock Geek

Posted 22 February 2011 - 12:27 PM

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I don't... know... what you're talking about. If you think it's bad to subdue counter-revolutionary elements in a given area and defend against capitalist attacks, then you're just plain retarded. But I don't know where you got forcing the entire the entire world into a new system. The whole point of communist revolution is for the working class to emancipate itself.

I know what the idea is.  I'm talking about the reality.  In all likelihood, the revolution isn't going to go exactly as planned, and the more people you involve in it, the greater the chance of something, somewhere going wrong.  I'm not saying that we should actively try to prevent worldwide (anarchist) revolution.  I'm saying that we shouldn't be waiting for it, because even if it did happen, it wouldn't be desirable in comparison to small scale...

Punk Rock Geek

Posted 22 February 2011 - 12:27 PM

I accidentally closed the window and my reply got deleted, so this is going to be quick.

View Postabolish misery, on 22 February 2011 - 05:30 AM, said:


No? participating in parliamentary politics has nothing to do with anarchism or pro-revolutionary politics.
Okay?  How is that relevant to Chomsky himself having "nothing to do" with anarchism?

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Which means very little without a revolutionary consciousness, which unions do not create. Worker's solidarity fits pretty nicely within the logic of capital. Without a desire to orient oneself toward the destruction of the capitalist cl...

abolish misery

Posted 22 February 2011 - 05:30 AM

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So when I support the Palestineans or whomever, it's not about national liberation. That's merely a consequence of disobedience, just as reform is. It was Machiavelli who wrote in his famous defense of tyranny that for a prince to maintain power of a new principality, he should minimize the amount of changes made to the existing customs and laws. For when people realize that change is possible, their expectation of improvement will give them a cause to take up arms. In other words, the problem with revolution isn't that the conditions aren't bad enough. It's that people don't think change is possible. This can be further verified by the wave of uprisings following Ben Ali's ousting in Tunisia. The rest of the world didn't get worse overnight. It was social conditions that acted as fuel--the power of human psychology.
Again, you're incredibly vague about “supportin...

abolish misery

Posted 22 February 2011 - 05:30 AM

[quote name='Punk Rock Geek' timestamp='1298189609' post='89522']
You're not clear. Are you saying that being an anarchist has nothing to do with anarchism?[/quote] No? participating in parliamentary politics has nothing to do with anarchism or pro-revolutionary politics.


[quote]
There is no confusion. I said we needed to be careful with our words. The union is a means to an end, with the end being workers solidarity. [/quote] Which means very little without a revolutionary consciousness, which unions do not create. Worker's solidarity fits pretty nicely within the logic of capital. Without a desire to orient oneself toward the destruction of the capitalist class relation, then worker's solidarity means absolutely nothing at all.

[quote]
I misread your post. You quickly changed from one topic to another, and I'm not sure how they relate, or where you're going with it.[/quote] Yeah, but I d...

Punk Rock Geek

Posted 20 February 2011 - 03:13 AM

View Postabolish misery, on 19 February 2011 - 11:52 PM, said:

Which is a personal decision, and has nothing to do with anarchism or communism at all in any way shape or form. Just to be clear.

You're not clear.  Are you saying that being an anarchist has nothing to do with anarchism?

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A more democratic workplace does not mean the absence of capitalism. Capitalism is not so much a system but a logic that governs social relationships. It is absolutely possible for there to be no "bosses" and there still be capitalism. Democracy isn't the question. And I'm not against worker solidarity....

All Dead

Posted 20 February 2011 - 02:31 AM

View PostPunk Rock Geek, on 19 February 2011 - 11:19 PM, said:

Not to mention, a collapse in the world system would in all eventuality lead to shortages of food, creating factions that will fight for their own survival.  No doubt, it is a problem that could be potentially fixed, but not one that will have any immediate solution amongst the chaos.
War...War never changes.
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abolish misery

Posted 20 February 2011 - 12:08 AM

If you would like, I can link you to some things to read.

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