57 replies to this topic

[EatShitAndCry]

It's okay for a black comedian to make a joke about white people because there is not a history of black people oppressing white people. White people have historically oppressed black people. They have used them as slaves, they have formed gangs to kill them, and they have declared them a lower species. But white people have felt so fucking entitled to their right to still make fun of the group they oppressed. To push on the bruise.

Look, I'm the grandson of a Holocaust survivor. I don't know half of my family because of the Holocaust. And some people think that they can make Holocaust jokes ("Oh, I know it was bad, I'm just showing that even serious situations and events can be funny") to me without me never speaking to them again or breaking their nose. They don't even know that I'm Jewish half the time. And the people who make those jokes are not Nazis or anti-semites. In fact, for the most part they're good people. And they make the joke with the supposed tacit understanding that they don't really believe it, but that doesn't fucking matter. It is threatening to me, as a Jew, for people to think of the Holocaust as a joking matter. It opens old, old wounds for people to joke about what haunted my beloved grandfather. What killed my great grandmother, great grandfather, and all of his 11 brothers and sisters.

I feel like I'm getting a little too emotionally invested in this, so excuse me if I'm going off on a tangent. But your joke, it can hurt in ways you (as a white male) cannot understand.

[xJackyx]

^All right. I see what you're saying. I apologize if I've crossed a line.

Punk Rock Geek, on 03 August 2012 - 12:37 PM, said:

Well, I think the idea is that it would be up to the people who heard the joke to decide whether or not it was offensive/okay or not.  It's impossible for you and I to make that sort of declaration.  But I understand what you mean.

I can go with that. I suppose as a white, straight American male I'm unfairly priveleged and as such do lack the capability to make that declaration. Again, I apologize to anyone who thinks I may have crossed a line.

That said: I didn't ever support jokes about things such as the Holocaust or slavery. I'm talking about simple, stupid, obviously untrue stereotypes. I know as well as anyone here that the vast majority of black people aren't criminals, the vast majority of Asians aren't bad drivers, the vast majority of Hispanics aren't illegal immigrants, et cetera. That's why I don't take offense to those jokes. Jokes about actual suffering, especially racial/sexual identity/religious persecution, are not okay in any situation and I think it's important that I go on the record as saying that those are not okay.

[Sammysaint]

xJackyx, on 03 August 2012 - 12:23 PM, said:

I didn't read their apology, ex-fucking-scuse me for being bothered what was a very transphobic post. Racism is okay? Really? If you're going to argue, please do it in a mature way. That's just ridiculous.

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[xJackyx]

You said I "moan about transphobia" but "racism is OKAY". I understand that you weren't actually saying that I think racism is all right, but still that's a little bit out there. I'm talking humor, offensive as it may be. The woman on the other thread [though she apologized and did not stand by her words] made a very anti-transgender statement and was completely serious. Totally different levels.

Edited by xJackyx, 04 August 2012 - 02:11 PM.

[Sammysaint]

xJackyx, on 03 August 2012 - 04:44 PM, said:

You said I "moan about transphobia" but "racism is OKAY". I understand that you weren't actually saying that I think racism is all right, but still that's a little bit out there. I'm talking humor, offensive as it may be. The guy on the other thread [though he apologized and did not stand by his words] made a very anti-transgender statement and was completely serious. Totally different levels.

Kristy is a woman.
And if you had read the rest of the thread, you would've seen me go batshit crazy about it

[Punk Rock Geek]

Sammysaint, on 03 August 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

Kristy is a woman.
And if you had read the rest of the thread, you would've seen me go batshit crazy about it

He's referring to what Sertra said.

[Sammysaint]

Punk Rock Geek, on 03 August 2012 - 05:55 PM, said:

He's referring to what Sertra said.

Is he? all I saw was him quoting Kristy.

edit: Just looked back at the thread and yeah, quoted Kristy.

[YQS]

I guess what Punk Rock Geek said makes the most sense: it's up to the audience to decide if the joke was okay or not.

[xJackyx]

YQS, on 03 August 2012 - 11:13 PM, said:

I guess what Punk Rock Geek said makes the most sense: it's up to the audience to decide if the joke was okay or not.

Yep. I have friends that would be okay with that sort of humor and I have friends that wouldn't. I know this and I hold my tongue around the ones that would be offended.

Sammysaint, on 03 August 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

Kristy is a woman.
And if you had read the rest of the thread, you would've seen me go batshit crazy about it

My apologies to Kristy, in that case. I'll amend my post to read 'woman', assuming there's no edit time-out thing.

One thing I have to ask, and I'm not trying to start an argument, just wondering: if we're apparently on the same page on the transgender debate, why bring it up? Why say 'moan about transphobia'? The way I read it, that just sounds like you thought I created an issue where there wasn't one.

Edited by xJackyx, 04 August 2012 - 02:11 PM.

[SertraOD]

xJackyx, on 03 August 2012 - 04:44 PM, said:

You said I "moan about transphobia" but "racism is OKAY". I understand that you weren't actually saying that I think racism is all right, but still that's a little bit out there. I'm talking humor, offensive as it may be. The woman on the other thread [though she apologized and did not stand by her words] made a very anti-transgender statement and was completely serious. Totally different levels.

She's a young girl from what I believe is a small town in a very white trash kind of place to live.

Plus, it wasn't against trans. She was in shock that one of her favorite rock stars turned out to be a woman. Try to be understanding from her point of view; she wasn't being hateful.

[xJackyx]

SertraOD, on 04 August 2012 - 03:18 PM, said:

She's a young girl from what I believe is a small town in a very white trash kind of place to live.

Plus, it wasn't against trans. She was in shock that one of her favorite rock stars turned out to be a woman. Try to be understanding from her point of view; she wasn't being hateful.

I'm trying to. But just because she didn't want him to do it doesn't justify what she said. She apologized, and I respect that and I hold no grudge. But at the time the only post of hers I had read was that one and all I saw was intolerance. I know she said "if it were anyone else, I wouldn't care". But the vast majority of the post was along the lines of "that's just wrong" and "he's a MAN". That's why I had an issue with it.

[Sammysaint]

xJackyx, on 04 August 2012 - 02:10 PM, said:

Yep. I have friends that would be okay with that sort of humor and I have friends that wouldn't. I know this and I hold my tongue around the ones that would be offended.



My apologies to Kristy, in that case. I'll amend my post to read 'woman', assuming there's no edit time-out thing.

One thing I have to ask, and I'm not trying to start an argument, just wondering: if we're apparently on the same page on the transgender debate, why bring it up? Why say 'moan about transphobia'? The way I read it, that just sounds like you thought I created an issue where there wasn't one.

You did because that occurred months ago and you clearly didn't read any further than that one post because many people on the forum, myself especially, were very disgusted and she corrected herself and apologised profusely. You brought it up again and instead of accepting she'd apologised, you're still carrying on now.
I also don't know why we're "apparently" on the same page on the transgender debate, please, show me where we differ.

Anyway you've derailed the whole fucking topic from the ridiculous point that was brought up in the first place, i.e racism. Yet you think racist jokes are okay as long as nobody of another race is around so dw i know where you stand on racism.

[xJackyx]

Sammysaint, on 04 August 2012 - 05:32 PM, said:

You did because that occurred months ago and you clearly didn't read any further than that one post because many people on the forum, myself especially, were very disgusted and she corrected herself and apologised profusely. You brought it up again and instead of accepting she'd apologised, you're still carrying on now.
I also don't know why we're "apparently" on the same page on the transgender debate, please, show me where we differ.

Anyway you've derailed the whole fucking topic from the ridiculous point that was brought up in the first place, i.e racism. Yet you think racist jokes are okay as long as nobody of another race is around so dw i know where you stand on racism.

A. I didn't read the timestamp nor the rest of the thread, because I was appalled by the post and felt the need to respond immediately.
B. I just said apparently because... I don't really know why.
C. See, the thing is, I made a point to say that the race of people being told the racist joke is irrelevant. If someone's okay with that sort of humor it doesn't matter if they're white, black or green. They can appreciate it. If someone's uncomfortable with it, whether they're a minority race or just a white guy that doesn't appreciate that sort of humor, they aren't okay with it thus someone shouldn't tell them a joke like that. I don't think it's only okay if it's only white people, that's stupid. I think it's only okay if 1. the jokes aren't making light of actual human suffering and 2. if those being told the joke are all right with it.

Edited by xJackyx, 04 August 2012 - 06:51 PM.

[Punk Rock Geek]

Sammysaint, on 03 August 2012 - 08:24 PM, said:

Is he? all I saw was him quoting Kristy.

edit: Just looked back at the thread and yeah, quoted Kristy.

Thought you were referring to the most recent thing he said, which was directed at Sertra.

[Sammysaint]

Punk Rock Geek, on 05 August 2012 - 12:52 AM, said:

Thought you were referring to the most recent thing he said, which was directed at Sertra.

omg wat are you talking about he was talking about Kristy and even edited his post now to refer to her as a woman so it was ok over

[Punk Rock Geek]

Sammysaint, on 05 August 2012 - 10:31 AM, said:

omg wat are you talking about he was talking about Kristy and even edited his post now to refer to her as a woman so it was ok over

Here:
http://anti-flag.com..._140#entry99054

[soybot]

GUYS MY INJUN SKIN IS IN FULL GEAR AND I'M  SUPA BROWN AND IT'S PRETTY EXCITING

[All Dead]

On the subject of racist jokes, once you've heard Juan, you've heard Jamal.